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QUESTION 6
WHAT ARE CATHOLICS TO THINK OF VATICAN II? |
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The Second Vatican Council was a meeting of
the world’s bishops for four sessions between October 11, 1962, and December 8,
1965. Pope John XXIII, in his opening speech to the Council (November 11,
1962), declared its aims to be the following: |
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that
the Catholic Faith should be kept and taught,
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but taught in the language of modern man by a magisterium
“which is predominantly pastoral in character,”
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and this without resorting to any condemnations,
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thus appealing to all
peoples (this Council was to be ecumenical, not only in the sense of being
a general council of the Church, but also in that of appealing to the
religiosity of all people of whatever religion).
Pope Paul VI agreed with his predecessor: |
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"[Vatican II] was the most important [event] because... above all it sought to meet pastoral needs and, nourishing the flame of charity, it has made a great effort to reach not only the Christians still separated from communion with the Holy See, but also the whole human family."
(Closing Brief,
December 8, 1965)
With such ideals, it is little wonder to find
Catholic teaching presented:
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weakly (no definitions or condemnations),
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confusedly (no technical, scholastic terminology),
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and one-sidedly (so as to attract non-Catholics).
All such vague and ambiguous teaching, already liberal in its method, would be interpreted in its true liberal sense after the Council. Consider, for
example:
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CONCILIAR TEACHING |
HOW INTERPRETED BY ROME1 |
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The liturgy of the word is stressed
(Sacrosanctum Concilium,2 §9),
and the banquet aspect (§10), as well as active participation
(§§11,14), and therefore the vernacular (§§36,54). |
The New Mass (cf.
QUESTION
5). |
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Catholics should pray with Protestants
(Unitatis Redintegratio, §§4,8). |
Eucharistic Hospitality (cf.
QUESTION
8). |
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The Church of Christ subsists in (not is) the
Catholic Church (Lumen Gentium, §8), |
It is also in “separated Churches” (Ut Unum
Sint,3 §11). |
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which has separated brethren in separated
“Churches” (Unitatis Redintegratio, §3), |
All the baptized are in Christ’s Church (Ut
Unum Sint, §42). |
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which ought to be as sisters (Unitatis
Redintegratio, §14). |
And so there is no need to convert, e.g., the
Orthodox.4 |
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Seminarians should take into account modern
philosophy, progress in science (Optatam
Totius, §15), |
Secular university studies and
abandoning Thomism. |
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psychology, and sociology (§20). |
Open spirituality and subjective morality. |
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Marriage and married love equated (Gaudium
et Spes, §§48,50). |
Annulments fiasco (cf.
QUESTION
8). |
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The Church renounces privileges civil authorities grant her (§76). |
Catholic religion no longer to be the religion of any States. |
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Wish for a World Authority (§82). |
Full support for UN |
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Rite and formulae of penance are to be revised
(Sacrosanctum Concilium §72). |
Face to face confessions and General Absolutions.5 |
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Extreme Unction should be an Anointing of
the Sick (§§73,75). |
New matter, form and subject (i.e., the sick, not just those in
danger of death). |
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| FOOTNOTES
TO THIS TABLE
1 How
Rome's guidelines are further interpreted as seen in the parishes is a
whole other story.
2 The documents of Vatican II are referred to by their
introductory Latin words, or by the initials of these.
3 Ut Unum Sint, Pope John Paul II, May 25, 1995.
4 Cf., The Joint International Commission for the
Theological Dialogue between the Roman Catholic Church and the Orthodox
Church, which forbade mutual "proselytizing."
Balamand, Lebanon, 17 to 24 June 1993.
5 Does this affect the "substance of the
sacraments" over which the Church has no power? (Cf.,
Pius XII, quoted in PRINCIPLE 5) |
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More gravely, the Council was hijacked by the liberal elements within the Church, who from the very beginning schemed to have rejected the
pre-conciliar preparatory schemas and replaced by progressive ones prepared by their own “experts.” The liberals were also able to get their members
onto the Council Commissions. The new schemas, passed as the Council’s decrees, constitutions, and declarations, contain, more or less explicitly,
some of the same doctrinal errors for which liberals in the past had been condemned. Let us take by way of example the following passages: |
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VATICAN
II TEACHING |
CATHOLIC
TEACHING |
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"Man is the only
creature on earth that God has wanted for its own sake" (Gaudium
et Spes, §24), |
"The Lord
hath made all things for Himself" (Prov. 16), |
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and "all
things on earth should be ordained to man" (§12). |
...
to help him save his soul. |
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Moreover, "by His
incarnation the Son of God has in a certain way united Himself with each
man" (§22), |
God assumed an
individual nature (e.g., Dz. 114), |
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so "Human
nature... has been raised in us also to a dignity beyond compare"
(§22), |
"...
a little less than the angels..." (Ps. 8:6) |
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and because of "sublime
dignity of the human person" (§26), |
Only he who lives
well is worthy (Apoc. 3:4). |
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his "rights
and duties are universal and inviolate" (§26); including: |
He
who buries his talent will be stripped of it |
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"The Vatican Council
declares that the human person has a right to religious freedom..."
(Dignitatis Humanae, §2), |
Contrary
condemned statement: "Liberty of conscience and of
worship is the proper right of every man..." (Pius IX, Quanta
Cura) |
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"...
all men should be immune from coercion on the part of ... every human
power so that, within due limits, nobody is forced to act against his
convictions nor is anyone to be restrained from acting in accordance
with his convictions..." (§2), |
Contrary
condemned statement: "... the best condition of
society is the one in which there is no acknowledgment by the government
of the duty of restraining... offenders of the Catholic religion, except
insofar as the public peace demands" (Pius IX, Quanta
Cura). |
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"This right of the
human person to religious freedom must be given such recognition in the
constitutional order of society as will make it a civil right"
(§2), |
Contrary
condemned statement: "Liberty of conscience and of
worship ... should be proclaimed and asserted by law in every correctly
established society ..." (Pius IX, Quanta Cura). |
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"...
the Spirit of Christ has not refrained from using (separated
churches) as means of salvation" (Unitatis Redintegratio,
§3), and so, |
PRINCIPLE
2 |
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"ecumenical action
should be encouraged so that ... Catholics might cooperate with their
separated brethren ... by a common profession before the nations of
faith in God and in Jesus Christ ..." (Ad Gentes,
§115). |
PRINCIPLE
7 |
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Why, even
concerning non-Christian religions: "The Catholic Church
rejects nothing of what is good and holy in these religions. She
has a high regard for the manner of life and conduct..." (Nostra
Aetate, §2), |
"All
the gods of the Gentiles are devils." Ps. 95.
"... beware lest thou have a mind to imitate the abominations of
those nations" (Dt. 18: 9). |
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"Now, episcopal
consecration confers, together with the office of sanctifying, the duty
also of teaching and ruling..." (§21). |
"This (episcopal)
Dignity, in fact, depends immediately on God as to the power of
orders, and on the Apostolic See as to the power of
jurisdiction..." (Deesemus Nos, Pope Pius VI). |
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The Council itself both encouraged liberal trends (and its encouragement became post-conciliar Vatican policy) and departed from traditional
Catholic teaching, but it has no authority for either (PRINCIPLE
5).
Our position must be:
...we refuse ...to follow the Rome of neo-Modernist and neo-Protestant tendencies which became clearly manifest during the Second Vatican Council and, after the Council, in all the reforms which issued from
it. (Declaration of Archbishop Lefebvre,
APPENDIX
I)
And it is neo-Modernist tendencies that the Council is all about ("...Pope John Paull II makes not Holy Scripture, but rather Assisi, the shibboleth
for the current understanding of the Council." Pope John Paul
II's Theological Journey to the Prayer Meeting of Religions in Assisi, Part I,
p. 46 [APPENDIX
II]).
BUT WASN’T THE COUNCIL INFALLIBLE?
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Not by reason of the extraordinary magisterium, for it refused to define anything. Pope Paul VI himself, in an audience on January 12, 1966, said
that it “had avoided proclaiming in an extraordinary manner dogmas affected by the mark of
infallibility” (Cf. the declaration of the Theological
Commission of Mar. 6, 1964, and repeated by the Council's General Secretary
on Nov. 16, 1964: "In view of conciliar practice and the
pastoral purpose of the present Council, this sacred Synod defines matters
of faith or morals as binding on the Church only when the Synod itself
openly declares so." It never did.).
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Nor by reason of the ordinary universal magisterium,
because this is not a defining power, but one of passing on what was always
believed. The “universality” in question is not just one of place (all bishops) but also of time (always)
(cf., Vatican I and
PRINCIPLE
6).
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Nor even by reason of the simply authentic magisterium, because the object of all magisterium is the deposit of faith to be guarded sacredly and expounded faithfully (Vatican I,
Dz 1836), and not to adopt as Catholic doctrine the “best expressed values of two centuries of ‘liberal
culture,’” even if they are “purified” (Cardinal
Ratzinger, Gesu, Nov. 1984, p. 72. Cf. Gaudium et
Spes, §§11, 44).
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OTHER ARTICLES ON THIS
TOPIC |
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Gherardini agrees with SSPX in new book about Vatican II
Msgr. Gherardini is a phenomenon producing seismic reactions in
the Roman milieu. His is a dissenting voice in the all too
common chorus of Hosanna in praise of the past Council... 5-11-2012
Is recognizing the SSPX questioning the Council?
"The
rift between the Holy See and the SSPX arises because the
Society rejects these particular elements of Vatican II
[religious liberty, ecumenism, collegiality], not because of an
intention on the part of the Holy See to defend Vatican II as a
whole"…
4-19-2012
“Magisterium or living tradition?”, Fr. Gleize denounces
a false dilemma
"Why this confusion? Why reduce the living magisterium
to the magisterium of the present? Because since Vatican
II they have been trying to invent a new magisterium.
The magisterium is redefined, because its task [now] is
to express the continuity of a subject and no longer the
continuity of an object..."
2-3-2012 DICI NEWS
SSPX answers Roman expert
L’Osservatore Romano of December 2, 2011, published a study
by Msgr. Fernando Ocariz, one of the four experts who
represented the Holy See during the recent doctrinal discussions
with the SSPX October 2009-April 2011). The central question of
the magisterial value of the Second Vatican Council is addressed
straightforwardly, yet nevertheless insufficiently...
1-31-2012

Debate about Vatican II: Fr. Gleize responds to Msgr. Ocariz
On at
least 4 points, the teachings of Vatican II are obviously in
logical contradiction to the pronouncements of the previous
traditional Magisterium, so that it is impossible to interpret
them in keeping with the other teachings already contained in
the earlier documents of the Church’s Magisterium...
DICI NEWS
12-29-2011
Msgr. Gherardini: Vatican II is not a super-dogma
A
translation of an insightful article by Msgr. Gherardini which
provides an answer to Msgr. Ocariz's recent published defense of
Vatican II. The article causes one to ask: If the Second
Vatican Council is part of the Magisterium what adherence must
be given to its text?
12-12-2011
Cardinal says post-conciliar Church is historically &
theologically illegitimate!
"But there cannot be, nor could there be, a pre-Conciliar
Church and a post-Conciliar Church! If this could be so, the
second one—ours—would be historically and theologically
illegitimate!"
11-10-2011
Roman Debates on the eve of Vatican II’s golden
jubilee
It is
rather encouraging to witness the controversy over the conciliar
era broaden its front and coming from Rome. Fireworks are
already sending sparks from all sides, on the eve of the golden
jubilee of the opening of the Council...
10-28-2011
Fissures in the impregnable walls of Vatican II: a petition to
the pope
An
SSPX.ORG commentary and some extracts about DICI's posting, "50
Catholic leaders petition Pope Benedict XVI for a more in-depth
examination of the Second Vatican Council"
10-14-2011
50 Catholic leaders petition Pope Benedict XVI for a
more in-depth examination of the Second Vatican Council
"In our souls and consciences as believers,
this petition, written with all deference toward You,
seems perfectly in harmony, we dare say, with the work
of restoring, renewing and purifying the Church Militant
that Your Holiness has courageously undertaken, despite
resistance and difficulties of all sorts that are known
to everyone..."
10-14-2011 |
The
Second Ecumenical Vatican Council: a Debate That Has Not Taken
Place,
by Msgr. Brunero Gherardini
This book is a sequel to The Second Ecumenical
Vatican Council: a Debate To Be Opened, that
appeared in 2009. In this new work, Msgr. Gherardini
does not stop at deploring that the debate on Vatican II
shouldn't take place, he even shows why it would be more
indispensable than ever today. And above all, he
indicates how this debate could be opened, giving the
reader the first elements of a rigorous analysis, far
from sterile invectives and blind ovations...
9-19-2011
Vatican II: a debate between Romano Amerio, Msgr.
Gherardini and Msgr. Pozzo
A brief analysis on the "authentic interpretation" of
Vatican II [DICI]
9-29-2010
Two Key Points for
the Church's Recovery
Some insightful solutions for ending the ecclesiastical crisis
10-12-2010
Two Interpretations of Vatican II: Myth or Reality?
Covers
the two opposing views of the Council. Includes the
article "The Erosion of the Council's Authority"
Reply of Archbishop Lefebvre to Cardinal Ottaviani after
the Council
Written in December
1966, nearly a year after the conclusion of Vatican II,
Archbishop Lefebvre details the confusion that was already
occurring so early in the missionary Africa amongst the
Holy Ghost Fathers
Archbishop Lefebvre Preparing the Council (1959 - 1962)
A brief story about Archbishop
Lefebvre's preparing the original schema for Vatican II
Collegiality
Fr. Basil Wrighton explains this keynote error of Vatican II and
the liberal machinations that caused its adoption by
Vatican II
How are Catholics to respond to the present crisis in the Church?
Fr. Peter Scott gives an
excellent analysis and practical answers to this important
question
Post-Conciliar Church: is it a new religion?
This Catholic FAQ makes the proper
distinctions while showing the revolutionary nature of Vatican
II
Roman Protestants
This classic 1982 article by Fr. Wrighton demonstrates how "the spirit of Vatican II"
is protestantizing Catholics
Off Center
Is belief in the Catholic Faith "left", "right" or "center"?
Supposedly after Vatican II, such groups do not indeed exist and
exemplify how closely Catholics adhere to the "super" Council. This philosophical defense by Dr. Peter Chojnowski demolishes
such a liberal view
What Should
We Make of Assisi I & II?
Explains
dangerous theological mentalities of Assisi I (held in 1986) and its
devastating consequences. Also applicable to Assisi II (2002).
Include further related materials
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